From Pirate Party of Canada
Transcript from November 11th, 2010 Federal Council Meeting
[21:31] <~MikkelPaulson> in that case, I'll call the meeting to order
[21:32] <+Zblewski> Okay.
[21:32] <~MikkelPaulson> Stephane, how goes the auditor search?
[21:32] <+Nuitari> not so good
[21:32] <+Nuitari> price is between 4k and 8k
[21:32] <~MikkelPaulson> nobody willing to work for a percentage huh?
[21:32] <+Zblewski> That's ridiculous.
[21:32] <~MikkelPaulson> in the long run we'd be better off with a flat rate, but we're not
there yet
[21:33] <~MikkelPaulson> how soon do we need one?
[21:33] <+Nuitari> I've left a message with the one doing the rhino party
[21:33] <+Nuitari> 30 days from yesterday
[21:33] <~MikkelPaulson> okay
[21:34] <~MikkelPaulson> Elections Canada doesn't have a problem with us using the same
auditor as another party?
[21:34] <+Nuitari> well
[21:34] <+Nuitari> Elaine's answer was very vague
[21:34] <+Nuitari> forwarding it to you
[21:34] <+Nuitari> I think as long as their order's rules allows it it is fine
[21:35] <~MikkelPaulson> yeah, sounds like they're good with it
[21:35] <+Zblewski> Like I said, if there's anything going on that you need clarification
on, give me a ring and I'll go there myself to ask
[21:36] <~MikkelPaulson> sounds good
[21:36] <~MikkelPaulson> hm
[21:36] <~MikkelPaulson> if we have to pay a flat rate, would that be up-front?
[21:36] <+Nuitari> no,on audit
[21:37] <+Nuitari> we could always sign with someone and ditch them if we find someone
cheaper
[21:37] <+Nuitari> but I don't like leading people on, esp small guys
[21:37] <~MikkelPaulson> hm, well it's a bit better I guess
[21:37] <~MikkelPaulson> yeah
[21:37] <+Zblewski> indeed
[21:37] <+Nuitari> we also don't have to have one in the same region
[21:37] <+Nuitari> but there might be special things to do
[21:38] <~MikkelPaulson> they don't need access to the paper archive?
[21:39] <+Zblewski> maybe not
[21:39] <+Zblewski> Nuitari?
[21:40] <~MikkelPaulson> I guess we could do a donation drive as it comes close to audit
season
[21:41] <~MikkelPaulson> wish we could get a better prediction of how much we'll be raising
[21:41] <+Nuitari> yes they do, we it can be mailed I guess
[21:42] <~MikkelPaulson> actually we should start a donation drive as soon as we've got the
registration stuff in order
[21:42] <~MikkelPaulson> what's the situation there?
[21:43] <+Zblewski> Good question
[21:43] <+Nuitari> we are registered and can emit tax receipts
[21:43] <+Zblewski> Excellent.
[21:44] <~MikkelPaulson> did EC have any software for us?
[21:44] <+Nuitari> yes we have it
[21:44] <~MikkelPaulson> cool
[21:44] <+Nuitari> the software prints the receipts
[21:45] <+Zblewski> Should I request a copy then?
[21:45] <+Zblewski> In case I take contributions
[21:45] <~MikkelPaulson> do we need to adjust our financial year?
[21:45] <+Nuitari> MikkelPaulson, no
[21:45] <+Nuitari> Zblewski, you can't right now
[21:46] <~MikkelPaulson> you need to be an agent
[21:46] <+Nuitari> right now only the website and myself can take contributions for the party
[21:46] <+Zblewski> Gotcha.
[21:46] <~MikkelPaulson> so the only thing we still have to sort out is the new auditor?
[21:46] <+Nuitari> yes
[21:47] <~MikkelPaulson> is there a dedicated web interface for donations on its way?
[21:48] <~MikkelPaulson> I'd like to start a donation drive right away, but it'd be nice to
reduce friction first
[21:48] <~MikkelPaulson> well, dedicated/independent from member registration
[21:49] <~MikkelPaulson> it needs to be straightforward for people to donate without joining
or to donate after they've been a member for a while
[21:50] <+Nuitari> yes it does
[21:50] <+Nuitari> it's on its way
[21:50] <+Nuitari> just don't even have my main computer backonline yet
[21:50] <+Nuitari> have to wait for the paint to dry more
[21:50] <~MikkelPaulson> good stuff
[21:50] <~MikkelPaulson> well, anything I can do to help…
[21:51] <+Zblewski> By the way
[21:51] <+Zblewski> I'd like to bring something up
[21:51] <~MikkelPaulson> by all means
[21:51] <+Zblewski> at some point we're going to need to get a bit of funds to Jeff
[21:51] <~MikkelPaulson> yeah
[21:52] <+Zblewski> I tried reaching Stephane earlier this week by phone to discuss this
[21:52] <~MikkelPaulson> is there any barrier to writing a cheque right away?
[21:52] <+Zblewski> but his wife (who has a lovely voice) said he wasn't around
[21:52] <~MikkelPaulson> she's pretty too
[21:52] <~MikkelPaulson> he's a lucky man
[21:52] <+Zblewski> I can't comment, seeing I've never seen her (or him)
[21:53] <+Zblewski> Nor do I wish to comment, seeing how I might get a fist to the facw
[21:53] <+Zblewski> anyways
[21:53] <~MikkelPaulson> you should go up there for a day, bus ticket is like $20 for a
2-hour trip
[21:54] <+Nuitari> right, how much are we transfering to Jeff?
[21:55] <+Zblewski> JeffColeman: Ping
[21:55] <~MikkelPaulson> Zblewski: he's not voiced
[21:55] <~MikkelPaulson> did you get my receipts?
[21:56] <+Nuitari> MikkelPaulson, yes
[21:56] <+Nuitari> MikkelPaulson, can you voice him?
[21:56] <~MikkelPaulson> sure
[21:56] <~MikkelPaulson> if he's around
[21:57] <rintaran> He's not.
[21:58] <~MikkelPaulson> okay, he's not at the mo
[21:58] <~MikkelPaulson> I'm just sending him a text
[21:58] <~MikkelPaulson> actually I'll do it old-school and call him
[21:59] <+Zblewski> I usually call
[21:59] <+Zblewski> better results
[22:00] <~MikkelPaulson> rintaran informs me that he's storyboarding with his Winnipeg
volunteers at the moment
[22:00] <~MikkelPaulson> which I take to be a great sign
[22:00] <~MikkelPaulson> sounds like he may have had some success at his meeting
[22:00] <+Zblewski> =D
[22:01] <~MikkelPaulson> yeah
[22:01] <~MikkelPaulson> that's encouraging to hear
[22:02] <~MikkelPaulson> is apparently Jeff on another computer
[22:03] <JeffColeman> yes :)
[22:03] <JeffColeman> just working on a viral project here
[22:03] <+Zblewski> <3
[22:04] <JeffColeman> I scrolled the logs but did you guys actually ask me a question yet?
[22:04] <+Nuitari> yes
[22:04] <+Nuitari> how much $?
[22:04] <JeffColeman> hmmmm
[22:04] <JeffColeman> I'm planning to keep it small
[22:05] <~MikkelPaulson> you can email us a breakdown if you prefer
[22:05] <~MikkelPaulson> no need to put together an exact figure right now
[22:05] <JeffColeman> has something been budgetted?
[22:05] <~MikkelPaulson> how much do we have remaining?
[22:06] <+Nuitari> about 1300$
[22:07] <+Nuitari> + the audit reserve
[22:07] <~MikkelPaulson> including the expenses from my trip?
[22:08] <+Nuitari> yeah
[22:09] <~MikkelPaulson> cool
[22:10] <~MikkelPaulson> if we're considering contesting the Calgary Centre North
by-election next spring, we may want to hold some in reserve for that
[22:10] <JeffColeman> the simplest thing for bookkeeping would be to just transfer whatever
the party decides is the limit
[22:10] <JeffColeman> then I probably won't use all of it
[22:10] <~MikkelPaulson> at least there I could come down for a weekend to help out with the
campaign
[22:10] <JeffColeman> and the excess can be transferred back
[22:10] <~MikkelPaulson> that's true
[22:11] <~MikkelPaulson> it would be nice to have an idea of what you intend to spend though
[22:11] <JeffColeman> at this point my intention is to pretty much only spend on printed
materials
[22:11] <~MikkelPaulson> so if you don't mind, see if you can get a rough budget to us in
the next day or two
[22:11] <JeffColeman> posters
[22:11] <JeffColeman> plus flyers with some flexibility in kind
[22:11] <JeffColeman> which I would mostly print as they got used up
[22:12] <JeffColeman> so that's what makes it hard to estimate in advance
[22:12] <~MikkelPaulson> yeah exactlly
[22:12] <JeffColeman> should I just estimate a max?
[22:12] <~MikkelPaulson> *exactly
[22:12] <~MikkelPaulson> yeah, like you say, if you have to transfer some back, there's no
problem or limitation
[22:13] <JeffColeman> okay--sooner is better though
[22:13] <~MikkelPaulson> for sure
[22:13] <JeffColeman> I am cool covering simple things myself and counting them as
"discounts" receipted to the account but not for tax purposes
[22:13] <~MikkelPaulson> you can also contribute to your own campaign in a pinch
[22:13] <~MikkelPaulson> just be sure to do the bookkeeping properly
[22:13] <JeffColeman> but still have a lot tied up in my business so not too liquid right now
[22:14] <~MikkelPaulson> yeah understandable
[22:14] <~MikkelPaulson> anyway, thanks for that, Jeff
[22:15] <+Nuitari> you can also contribute up to 1100$ to your campaign
[22:15] <+Nuitari> and get the tax refund
[22:15] <~MikkelPaulson> let us know and we'll get the money to you ASAP
[22:15] <JeffColeman> k, you'll have an estimate tonight
[22:15] <~MikkelPaulson> cool
[22:16] <+Nuitari> cc me onit
[22:16] <~MikkelPaulson> agent@ ?
[22:16] <+Nuitari> yeah
[22:17] <JeffColeman> k, will do
[22:18] <+Zblewski> >.>
[22:18] <+Zblewski> <.<
[22:18] <~MikkelPaulson> anything else for Jeff or shall we move on?
[22:18] <+Zblewski> I'll push back my call to you to Sunday, Jeff. Thumbs up.
[22:19] <~MikkelPaulson> thanks Jeff
[22:19] <~MikkelPaulson> okay, last order of business
[22:20] <+Zblewski> Go ahead
[22:20] <+Zblewski> Is it PPI?
[22:20] <~MikkelPaulson> second-last order of business
[22:20] <~MikkelPaulson> :P
[22:20] <~MikkelPaulson> a couple of days ago I was discussing the actions of Operation
Payback with K`Tetch and a few others
[22:20] <~MikkelPaulson> sounds like they're interested in suspending their attacks
[22:21] <~MikkelPaulson> and he suggested issuing a joint press release encouraging them to
stand down
[22:21] <~MikkelPaulson> I have some misgivings
[22:21] <~MikkelPaulson> but I wanted to get your input on that
[22:21] <+Zblewski> Go on\
[22:21] <+Zblewski> What are these misgivings
[22:22] <+Nuitari> I wouldn't discuss operation payback unless someone asks us about it
[22:22] <~MikkelPaulson> well, there are several levels
[22:22] <~MikkelPaulson> one, I'm hesitant to acknowledge their legitimacy as a political
force and the success of their actions
[22:23] <~MikkelPaulson> two, being that they're a splinter group, I don't know that we
should provide them with another soapbox
[22:24] <~MikkelPaulson> and three, I'm somewhat disinclined to antagonize what has until
now behaved as an online terrorist organization
[22:25] <~MikkelPaulson> sounds like the USPP is on board with it already
[22:25] <~MikkelPaulson> not officially anyway, but there's interest
[22:27] <+Zblewski> I agree with not giving them a soapbox
[22:28] <+Nuitari> have we been approached by them?
[22:29] <+Zblewski> No.
[22:29] <~MikkelPaulson> I was indirectly
[22:29] <~MikkelPaulson> which is why I'm raising it here
[22:29] <~MikkelPaulson> I'll let K`Tetch explain the USPP position
[22:30] <+K`Tetch> ok ,its not a uspp position as yet, mostly the other board members share
Mikkel's 3rd concern, that of antagonising htem
[22:30] <+K`Tetch> however, the thought is not to antagonise, but to point out that whatever
they've intentded, it's run the course, and than disruptions are just making things harder
[22:31] <+K`Tetch> that rather than a temporary downtime, with little long-term effect, they
participate in proper, constructive work, with their local party, or similar organisation,
and allow us to work effectively
[22:33] <+K`Tetch> we send a message we're against the DDOS, and that a constructive effort
needs to be done
[22:36] <+K`Tetch> ...
[22:36] <+Zblewski> Well
[22:36] <+Zblewski> I'm all for constructive dialogue as a tool
[22:36] <+Zblewski> It's how I prefer to operate
[22:36] <+Zblewski> that's why I helpedstart this party
[22:37] <+Zblewski> The whole question to me is
[22:38] <+Zblewski> 1. How will the Payback Anonymii react? Will it be adverse and will some
rogue members try and hit us?
[22:39] <+Zblewski> 2. What does this say to the groups affected? Will they take it as an
action that they feel is weak-minded?
[22:39] <+Zblewski> At this point, I'm wary of going either way
[22:40] <~MikkelPaulson> I'm not willing to proceed with this without a clear consensus in
the Federal Council
[22:40] <~MikkelPaulson> there are benefits, but I'm not convinced that the potential
disadvantages are worth it
[22:41] <+Zblewski> neither am I
[22:41] <~MikkelPaulson> Nuitari: still don't think we should touch the subject?
[22:42] <+Nuitari> I don't think there is much to gain by addressing them
[22:43] <~MikkelPaulson> shall we put it to a vote for the record? or anything else to add
K`Tetch?
[22:44] <~MikkelPaulson> I'll take that as a no
[22:45] <~MikkelPaulson> in that case, I move that the Pirate Party of Canada issue a public
appeal to the members of Anonymous to stand down their DDOS campaign
[22:45] <+Zblewski> Go ahead and put it to a vote if you wish
[22:45] <~MikkelPaulson> I vote no
[22:45] <+Zblewski> I vote no.
[22:45] <+Nuitari> No
[22:45] <~MikkelPaulson> Nuitari?
[22:46] <~MikkelPaulson> guess that settles it
[22:46] <~MikkelPaulson> sorry K`Tetch
[22:46] <~MikkelPaulson> good luck with the USPP
[22:46] * +Zblewski salutes K`Tetch
[22:46] <~MikkelPaulson> okay, NOW last order of business?
[22:46] <~MikkelPaulson> Mike, take 'er away
[22:47] <+Zblewski> We've been very silent on the PPI, and, this organization is the largest
grouping of our movement
[22:48] <+Zblewski> There would obviously be benefits and drawbacks to formally joining the
organization
[22:48] <+Zblewski> However, according to Samir Allioui, we are already one of 24 informal
members in their eyes
[22:48] <~MikkelPaulson> and we do have their logo on our membership card, for better or
worse
[22:48] <+Zblewski> I had a lengthly discussion with him, since he was the former leader of
the group
[22:49] <+Zblewski> I think that informal link is there for better or for worse
[22:49] <+Zblewski> at issue is formally joining them
[22:49] <~MikkelPaulson> it's definitely in our heritage
[22:50] <~MikkelPaulson> correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe when the issue was last
raised the sticking point for us was their financial expectations
[22:50] <+Zblewski> I believe so
[22:50] <+Zblewski> I'm not entirely sure, however
[22:50] <~MikkelPaulson> did you touch on that with Samir?
[22:50] <~MikkelPaulson> it'd be nice to have Jake here for this bit
[22:50] <+Zblewski> No, I was leaving financial issues to the current PPI administration
[22:50] <+Zblewski> What I propose
[22:51] <+Zblewski> is that we enter formal discussions with the PPI board about joining,
with no commitments to do so
[22:51] <+Zblewski> That way, we can try and flatten the issues between us
[22:52] <+Zblewski> such as lack of administrative order in terms of the rules
[22:52] <~MikkelPaulson> on principle I would like to play a bigger role in PPI
[22:52] <~MikkelPaulson> if that's practical, then I say go for it
[22:52] <+Zblewski> Nuitari?
[22:52] <~MikkelPaulson> but if there's going to be a significant burden on us, financial or
otherwise, I don't think it's worthwhile
[22:53] <~MikkelPaulson> not at this point in our life
[22:53] <+Nuitari> uh ?
[22:53] <+Nuitari> what's the question
[22:53] <~MikkelPaulson> so yeah, I'd be willing to open discussions with them
[22:53] <+Zblewski> Your thoughts on possibly joining PPI, or at least discussing it with
them
[22:53] <+Nuitari> brb
[22:53] <~MikkelPaulson> however, I think we should wait until after the by-election to go
down that road
[22:53] <+Zblewski> Yes.
[22:54] <+Zblewski> Like previously mentioned, there is a memo ready to go to start discussions wth them
[22:54] <~MikkelPaulson> so maybe we should raise this again at the meeting on December 2
[22:54] <+Zblewski> Samir suggested we have someone formally ready to attend PPIonline
meetings
[22:55] <+Zblewski> Do you want to hold off on instigating formal conversation, then? That's
fine with me if we postpone the vote unil then
[22:55] <~MikkelPaulson> that's what I'd suggest, yeah
[22:55] <~MikkelPaulson> we already have too much on our plate
[22:55] <~MikkelPaulson> no need to take on more
[22:55] <~MikkelPaulson> and joining PPI isn't urgent
[22:56] <+Zblewski> Gotcha.
[22:57] <+Zblewski> I'll be attending the council meetings until then
[22:57] <+Zblewski> for PPI
[22:58] <~MikkelPaulson> anything else?
[22:58] <+Zblewski> n'op.
[22:58] <~MikkelPaulson> already
[22:58] <~MikkelPaulson> in that case
[22:59] <~MikkelPaulson> I'll call the meeting adjourned
Also see Minutes and Vote Log
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